Screw Those Other Amendments

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It’s only the Second Amendment that really counts, at least in Rep. Ryan Zinke’s mind.

Consider the “War on Christmas.”  As Pogie points out, Zinke interprets the First Amendment to mean that we all need to say “Merry Christmas” a whole lot more.  From the the bill:

Whereas the Framers intended that the First Amendment of the Constitution, in prohibiting the establishment of religion, would not prohibit any mention of religion or reference to God in civic dialog: Now, therefore, be it … (So, reading the minds of the founding fathers, the supporters of H. Res. 564 propose that) … the House of Representatives—(1)recognizes the importance of the symbols and traditions of Christmas; (2)strongly disapproves of attempts to ban references to Christmas; and (3)expresses support for the use of these symbols and traditions by those who celebrate Christmas.

What pandering and a waste of everyone’s time.  There are wars out there that demand our attention.  This isn’t one of them.

So, the Constitution is flexible on First Amendment religious stuff but not so much on Second Amendment gun rights.

Legislation that Zinke and Sen. Steve Daines don’t favor has to do with keeping guns out of the hands of potential terrorists, violent felons and the mentally ill.  So, it’s up to the President to try an executive order. Here’s the link to the AP story, headlined, “Gun Sales: White House To Seek Expanded Background Checks.”

Zinke’s Facebook response is:

President Obama’s disregard for the Constitution knows no bounds. The Second Amendment is about more than hunting; it’s about defending our families, ourselves and our values as Americans. The Second Amendment defends all the others, and I will always stand ready to protect the rights of Montanans.

And here’s Daines after the San Bernardino massacre:

…the President is using this tragedy to pursue misguided firearm restrictions that would undermine our Second Amendment protections while doing nothing to address the most significant factors behind terrorism. I remain committed to protecting Montanans’ Second Amendment rights and will stand strong against efforts to dismantle those freedoms.

The Daines comment and jab at the President came shortly after his two ‘no’ votes in the Senate on expanded background checks. Both bills were reasonable and hardly seem like they infringe on basic Second Amendment rights.

The Constitution is just great for Zinke, and Daines, as long as it fits their agenda and makes for good sound bites.

 

 

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About the author

Pete Talbot

'Papa’ Pete Talbot is first and foremost a grandfather to five wonderful grandchildren. Like many Montanans, he has held numerous jobs over the years: film and video producer, a partner in a marketing and advertising firm, a builder and a property manager. He’s served on local and statewide Democratic Party boards. Pete has also been blogging at various sites for over a decade. Ping-pong and skiing are his favorite diversions. He enjoys bourbon.

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Rob KaileyptalbotJCNorma DuffyBig Swede Recent comment authors
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Don Pogreba
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TEst

Don Pogreba
Admin

Test 2

Big Swede
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Big Swede

“Wasting time”, that’s a good one. Zinke’s support fro Res.564 is a direct reaction to Obama’s policy of restricting the use of “Merry Christmas” in any correspondence of US House Representatives. So while certain political factions spend thousands of hours investigating the stacks of congressional mailings, terrorist’s Facebook rants are off limits in the (so called) vetting process in obtaining a visa. Tashfeen Malik comes to mind. “Law enforcement sources confirmed to CBS News that Malik made radical postings on Facebook as far back as 2012 — the year before she married Farook and moved to the U.S., reports CBS… Read more »

Norma Duffy
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Norma Duffy

Obama has never imposed restrictions on Merry christmas….. ever…..ever…ever. It’s all in your conservative heads. by the way Season’s Greetings, I say this because there is 15 other religions out there that have celebrations around Christmas too.

BY the way Swede, Christians, jewish people and muslims all celebrate the same God. The second prophet in Islam is Jesus Christ. and they celebrate christmas too…. but of course you wouldn’t know that because …. Uh, Fox News and Breitbart.

Big Swede
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Big Swede
JC
Guest

“Christians, jewish people and muslims all celebrate the same God.”

Really??!! And where did you come by that rationalization?

Rob Kailey
Guest

Excuse me? The children of Abraham? Ismael and Isaac/Israel? She’s not wrong, JC, nor is she ‘rationalizing’. Given the context, I think it might be better to question your motives. Are you just trying to pick a fight, or do you actually think every blog commenter should write a thesis to satisfy your sensibilities?

JC
Guest

Is the God of Christianity and the God of Islam the same? “No, the God of Christianity and the God of Islam are not the same. First of all, the God of Christianity is a Trinity where the God of Islam is not. The Trinity is the monotheistic teaching that God exists eternally as three distinct persons: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. In Islam, this is blatantly denied. It cannot be the case that God is a Trinity and also not a Trinity. Therefore, since they contradict each other, they cannot be the same.” I think that… Read more »

Don Pogreba
Admin

Another impressive response from JC. To support your contention about a complex theological question, you rely (without attribution) on a wingnut Christian site that also argues this: “The religion of Islam is not compatible with the Constitution and Bill of Rights of the United States. Islam teaches the adherence to Sharia Law, which is intended to be a complete guide for all areas of society including judges, lawyers, educators, government officials, the entertainment industries, families, and religious institutions. It would replace the Constitution. The President of the United States is sworn to uphold the Constitution, but a true Muslim could… Read more »

JC
Guest

Do wingnut christians have the same god as wingnut muslims, Don? The same god as yours?

Don Pogreba
Admin

Please tell us more, theologian. You’ve proven your mastery of the subject with your Google search. I look forward to more keen analysis.

You do know, though, expert that you are, that not all Christians believe in the Trinity, right? And that relying on one sect, especially a rabidly anti-Muslim one, for guidance might undermine your argument?

But by all means, continue to lash out at people to show how smart you are.

JC
Guest

You’re frothing again, Don. Are you suggesting that rabidly anti-muslim christians have a different god than pro-muslim christians? Maybe different from yours?

Don Pogreba
Admin

I’ ll leave it to people who read these comments to decide who is “frothing.” Only one of us relied on a source that claims Muslims can’t be President to support his argument.

You could always just apologize for having jumped all over Norma when it’s clear none of us are experts in this field, but that would be the act of someone who isn’t suffering from whatever demons ail you.

Rob Kailey
Guest

So it’s both, then. My mistake. If you had any real interest in a discussion of historical roots or religion or even the theology behind them, you would approach such a chat with half an ounce of respect for the topic or your ‘opposition’. You haven’t and you won’t. Instead, you will engage in the worst sort of “rationalization” to show how your toss-off zinger proves some goofy point that will insult those who disagree with you concerning foreign policy. As is usual, you then follow with a whine about you’re being insulted. I would remiss if I didn’t note… Read more »

JC
Guest

I don’t have “a discussion of historical roots or religion or even the theology behind them”. I’m interested in how “religious” people use religious zealotry as a way to advance certain forms of foreign policy. It isn’t what I think that is important. It is that there are many millions of christians, jews and muslims that disagree. There are many other choices I could have made to quote from. The one I chose was random. It is how they act, militarily, politically and via terrorism that is important. That some would suggest that all three monotheistic religions drink from the… Read more »

Rob Kailey
Guest

Norma’s point was actually valid from both our views. All three monotheistic religions concerning the God of Abraham have drunk from the same well. That they get high in different ways reveals a whole lot more about ‘believers’ than it does about those who point out a simple fact. I disagree with Norma on a number of points, but it’s very difficult to find her appeal to commonality a harm.

Don Pogreba
Admin

The Christmas season is an extremist form of Christianity? Wow, I wasn’t aware of that. Please enlighten us more.

Rob Kailey
Guest

Was that directed at me, Pogie? If so, you misunderstand. The Christmas season is not extremist. The pantheistic tripartite view of the Christian God is.

Don Pogreba
Admin

Nope. I thought I was answering JC. It gets confusing when he craps all over threads. My mistake. Sorry for the misdirected remark.

Big Swede
Guest
Big Swede

Believe me Don, no one’s jumping on Norma.

JC
Guest

Do you even have a clue why I chose a statement from a christian apologetics group to make my point? No, of course you don’t. Because their is a branch of christians that don’t believe that they and muslims share the same god. And to add to your ignorance about this topic, those christians don’t believe that a muslim could be president exactly because they don’t share the same god. So you’re going to lambast me for pointing to a source that confirms my statement? Or are you going to enforce your form of religious bigotry on those christians who… Read more »

Don Pogreba
Admin

That’s the best rationalization for your terrible source you could muster in twelve hours? Still not too late to apologize to Norma and jut act like a person.

It’s the Christmas season, right?

JC
Guest

I’ll think about it right after you apologize to my co-blogger and his family. Asshole.

Don Pogreba
Admin

For what?

JC
Guest

You have a total lack of self awareness, Don. Fortunately, I have a screen clip, and a long memory.

Don Pogreba
Admin

Every time one of you writes a post or comment that uses my name and I will respond in kind. If my reputation gets dragged through the mud by you two malcontents, you’re going to do it with real names attached. I’ve tried repeatedly to end this nonsense with the two of you, for at least four years. I’m not going to let it continue any longer. I took the earlier reference to his name down because of his hysterical claim that it was a threat to him. If you’d like me to put it back up, I certainly will.… Read more »

JC
Guest

Is that a threat, asshole?

Don Pogreba
Admin

Not at all. I’m just telling you what I will do. You can insult me at your site and block me from commenting, you can make 5 out of every 7 posts about me, you can post personal Facebook pages with names and pictures from anonymous bloggers here, and you can even come and insult me at own site. I’m just going to let people know who is behind it. That’s not a threat at all. That’s just fair. Or like I have suggested repeatedly, we could apologize and ignore each other. I’ve reached out to you two at least… Read more »

JC
Guest

Don, I’m not interested in emailing with you. While today’s email from you was measured, in the past you have not been. We could meet in person, as I travel to Helena frequently, but I doubt you’d want to do that. What I counter offer is this (and I speak only for myself here): I do not take well to threats. If you choose to out me, there will be consequences. You do not hold all the power here, and are not going to bully me. I propose that we return to the ideal of blogging where we are free… Read more »

Don Pogreba
Admin

Do what you want. My position is clear. You can choose to continue to smear me behind a pseudonym if you like. That’s entirely up to you.

JC
Guest

You can choose to smear me under your real name if you like. No different to me than if you were to use a pseudonym. Using your real name gives you no more “right” to smear me than if you use a pseudonym, here or elsewhere.

And by the way, you know that my initials are not a pseudonym, they are real, and that is the way my friends refer to me and have for decades.

But you still haven’t replied to my counter offer. No ad hominems and keep the personalities out, or not?

Don Pogreba
Admin

I think you don’t understand my point. There is no way to separate the two. If I write a post criticizing the more radical left for undermining what I believe should be more practical priorities, you will perceive that as a personal attack. If one of you writes a piece calling me a homophobic sexist, I will probably assume that’s a personal attack. Your site has devoted over half of its current front page to my posts and me personally. Before that, it was going after Polish Wolf, who actually was silenced when you outed him, something you’ve never apologized… Read more »

JC
Guest

Just one note here. I did not out Polish Wolf. He named himself in a comment at 4&20: https://4and20blackbirds.wordpress.com/2012/08/07/the-inevitable-boringness-of-liberalism/?replytocom=89473#respond The Polish Wolf: “Larry Kurtz, Craig Moore, and Dustin Hurst all call me by my full name. It’s not a secret. The visible name is merely for the sake of continuity: I’m not a public figure, so the name “Matthew Downhour” means nothing to most people (depending on where you live, JC), but the assumed name gives a level of continuity with everything I’ve written over the past several years.” The Polish Wolf was confirming that his real name was indeed… Read more »

Don Pogreba
Admin

I might be wrong about that. Of course, he felt like you violated his privacy and the privacy of his family when you posted their Facebook information and I trust him a great deal more than I trust you.

Of course, once upon a time, before you completely lost it, you were chagrined enough to go back and blur the Facebook image you had stolen the information from, too:
https://4and20blackbirds.wordpress.com/2014/03/03/cias-ned-succeeds-in-ukraine-where-democracy-failed/

But surely I’m wrong.

Don Pogreba
Admin

You’re welcome to come here and tell me how stupid I am all you like. I do enjoy your nuanced perspective on the issues. But please do remember these are commenting guidelines:
https://themontanapost.com/commenting/

I’ve explained before why a person using a pseudonym gets less latitude to be insulting. I don’t think you agree with my position, but it’s my site, so it doesn’t matter if you agree or not. If you choose not to comment again, that’s fine as well.

JC
Guest

And as I mentioned above, you may feel that a person using a pseudonym can be abused more than a person using a real name here. I see no distinction, and it has and still will raise my ire. Using a pseudonym or my using initials is not an invitation to abuse. You abuse me because I choose to use my initials as my “name” and I’ll abuse you back. As I don’t take well to threats, nor do I take well to bullying. You out me, there will be consequences. Your choice. Or you could just ban me, like… Read more »

Don Pogreba
Admin

“Maybe then we should just not write about each other for awhile,” he suggested for the tenth time, noting that the bad blood was unlikely to go away.

And, for the record, I have no idea who you are. I suspect most people who read my site don’t either.

JC
Guest

It appears that blogging and commenting will resume as before. You don’t get to tell me what to write about, and I won’t tell you what to write about. You attack me because i use a nickname, I’ll attack you. You out me, there will be consequences.

I offered to drop the personal and ad hominems. You refused to accept that. Let the record be clear.

Don Pogreba
Admin

I think anyone who reads this thread probably has a pretty clear understanding of which one of us is at fault and can’t just walk away. I feel sorry for you, but do what you need to do.

Don’t bother with enabling my comments at your site. I’m not coming back to comment there, so it doesn’t matter. You’re welcome to stink up threads here with your bitterness and rage, just as long as you can follow the commenting guidelines.

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